|ZanAmu: American/European/Asian/... Wives of Iranians - Religion Issues - Spiritual matters|
Are you married to an Iranian Man? Do you practice different religions? What religion are kids brought up? Does this difference in religions impact the relationship? Do you feel the religion has become more important as the relationship grows? Share your experience with us, submit to ZanAmu Form.
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Years Married =
Number of Children = 2
Country & City = South Africa, Cape Town
Subject = need advice
I have been in a relationship with a muslim man for more than 3years and we have a child together.He wants me to convert to the muslim religion before he we can get married. this places pressure on me as Im not sure if iam ready to make that decision yet.I read that it is permissable for a muslim man to get married to a christian or jewish woman - is this allowed in South Africa.If yes then how would we get married according to muslim customs and processes, in court or how?
I would appreciate the advice as we really love each other, I have no problem raising my kids in the muslim religion Iam just personally not in a space to make that decision for myself.
Please help., Marilyn
I am on the verge of a nervous breakdown. I am Catholic and 27 years old. I met my Persian Jewish boyfriend two years ago and we started dating about 6 months ago. Our relationship is so intense and unbelievable. We get along extremely well. He wanted me to move to LA for him and I did. I see his family every week and I attend all gatherings. I had no idea that my religion was such an issue. He has told me that it might be a problem and we might not end up together because I am not Jewish. I love this man with all of my heart and I know he loves me the same. He has told me that he sees himself marrying me and that it scares him because of the cultural differences. I have told him that I would convert and I have embraced his culture and his family, but it doesn't seem to be enough.
The other night he told me he didn't want to hurt me in the future because he wasn't sure if it would ever work out between us. He was crying and hysterical, as I was too. He called his parents to tell them how much he loved me, they told him I was a sweet girl but not to get too attached because it isn't right to end up with someone from such a different religion/culture.
At this point I am devastated. I have given him 1 million percent. He wants the relationship to keep going but he says there are no guarantees. In the past he told me that if religion was our only issue, he wouldn't let it ruin us in the long run. I am so confused and torn. The Persian Jewish girls are so nasty. I feel belittled. I don't even know if I can be the same towards him and his family knowing that they don't want him to end up with me. I am so incredibly hurt. Does anyone have any advice for me?
It seems that he is the problem not his family. It seems he needs his family's approval otherwise he would follow his heart. On the other hand, he know that he will need his family and he knows that his family will not be at ease with a catholic girl. JC, you can convert but you will never be a JEW. You can speak the language and learn the culture and cook better than his mom - you will never be PERSIAN.
I have heard this before from my Persian friend's mother as well as my Japanese friend's mother - "My son, go have your fun with this nice and sweet "non Persian" or "non Japanese" girl and when you are ready we'll find you a nice "Persian" or "Japanese" wife".
JC - I am Christian and my husband is also a Christian. I would have not date him or get close to him if he wasn't a Christian because Bible teaches us not to yoke with a non-believers. I believe its true for all religions and not just Christians. I say the same thing to my non-practicing Muslim friends - date and marry a non-practicing Muslim boy/girl. I say the same to my Jewish friend's kids. It didn't think how important the spirituality would be years ago - but now after many years of marriage I tell you that it is even more important than love. What has enables us to stay together thru hard times and ups & downs is our shared spiritual belief.
So, take some time, think about it, pray about it, consult with your close catholic friends, your priest, ... and then decide whether to pursue this relationship further or to walk away and save yourself a whole bunch of pain and heartache. You can't force two un-fitting pieces to fit to make a stable and comfortable relationship. And remember, his family is a part of him and they have to fit into the equation or he will not be happy and at peace.
Best of luck, Linda
Wow, I cannot believe the amount of people who willingly marry outside their faith. Even if your not "religious" this issue will come up, especially after you have children.
I was born and raised in Calif. an atheist, I became a Christian in 2000.
My husband was born and raised in Iran as a Muslim. He converted to Christianity in the 90's. He is a very devote follower of Christ and this has alot to do with the harmony in our relationship.
On the surface, we would appear not to have much in common, but the building block we have is Faith, and that is a solid base.
My husband believes fully in leaving the mother and father and cleaving to one's wife. I know I come first in his life, right after God. Then its the children, his work and his extended family.
When we become unequally yoked, as in Muslim/Christian marriage..this leads to some unintended consequences that may not be apparent in the beginning. Cultural issue become more of a focal point than they need to be as you search for common ground and beliefs. Same faith marriages build on a solid foundation...when you mix the religions, this foundation becomes shakey at best.
I love my husband dearly..yes there are cultural differences, but these are things I can easily live with and many are quite endearing.
My husband is my best friend and lover. He treats me with the utmost respect, more than any man I have ever known. I trust him in all regards and he truly admired by many in our community as a man of honor.
So for those of you having issues with your Persian Princes, first check out what you have in common, especially faith-wise. Find out if you can provide him with what he needs, such as respect and honor (and don't we all yearn to have that?) and can you live with his family involvement..Remember, this isn't necessarily an Iranian-only trait...I was previously married to a Midwestern man with a huge family that resembles many of the ones that have been negatively described here..
Anyway, life with my Persian Prince has been absolutely wonderful, perhaps not perfect, but still wonderful. I believe any relationship should have the common ground of faith to build upon.
Just my 2 cents, Laila
Country & City = USA, California
Category of Submission = Religeous Issues
Subject = Thank you ladies -- I have broken up with my Iranian Jewish Boyfriend of 18 months
My boyfriend and I were together for about a year and a half. This site helped me see that I was not alone in my pain, confusion and frustration. The relationship has finally ended -- the issues could not be resolved, and I am relieved I did not marry him.
I do not think I would be happy coming "second" to his family. I do not think his family would ever accept me (my now ex-boyfriend told me as much). And I don't think I would have patience to try, try, beg and beg some more to be loved by him and his family.
In a year and a half, I never once met a family member or even a friend of his. He avoided taking me to places where we might bump into someone he knew. I was, of course, never invited to any of his family or friends' parties or social fuctions.
There was a time when I felt we could have a wonderful life together ... but as someone on this site said, blood is thicker than water, and I know that I would make myself miserable trying to live up to impossible expectations.
I wish I knew why these men bother to date women outside their culture to begin with, when they know the problems.
He pursued me, even knowing is family would NEVER accept anything less than an Iranian Jewish bride for him. He told me this is why he never included me in his life.
I have learned a painful lesson, but I hope I won't make the same mistake in the future.
Thank you again -- this is a wonderful site, has given me good insight, and has made me realize that I have made a good choice for myself. Maybe some love can conquer all, but ours wasn't strong enough. -- Violet
I am so sorry that things didnt work out for u. sadly when cultures clash there is that issue. i have been blessed that my hunny's family is willing to give me a chance. like u said, its good u got out before it went any further.
We Americans dont have the strong sence of family that Iranians do. we make our family out of close friends rather than blood relations. He and I have faced this issue over and over. He doesnt see my ex-in-laws as family to me anymore but I remain closer to them than my own blood family. He has had a hard time understanding this closeness and the rift between my blood family.
I suppose how we cant see thier family ties being so strong they cant understand ours being so loose. he has often called Americans an "orphaned" culture made of broken familyies and lost children. in many ways I agree with him on that fact.
Good luck with future romances. I hope that u will find the man that will put u first, and if he doesnt that this time u will see the warning signs early. stay in touch if u need a freindly ear. I too am californian. im moving to iran in a few months to marry my man....
My big worry is how his family may change thier oppion about me after i get there. he and i have not told any of them that i am divorced...they may not be so welcoming when that tid bit is reveiled.
Good luck in love and life, kathryn
I really feel for the girl in this email. It is so sad. The guy I met is also Iranian Jewish. I have met his friends and by coincidence of my work industry I know his first cousin. Who invited me to dinner with his wife and my date. I guess it could just be a business interest. Anyway, its not that I'm looking to get married tommorow but I like not to start a relationship with closed doors.
Have you come across anyone who it has worked for? Should I have this chat with my date or just forget about it. Thanks
Yes it does work for some but you have to keep in mind that;
Religion may not be important to him or you at this point but it will always be very important to his family and eventually it will surface in your relationship - sooner if you have kids.
Even if his family or your family never interfere, believe Religion will be an issue as you each get older and go back to your own roots. Spirituality becomes much more important when we face hard times, major health issues, crisis, old age, ....
So my advise is, enjoy your time together, get to know each other and don't read too much ... too fast into it. Keep your eyes and your heart open and be wise. - ZanAmu Linda
Country & City = United States, New York
Subject = Foreign girl dating a Persian Jewish Guy
Dear Zan Amu
A couple of months ago I met this Persian Jewish Guy while travelling to LA. I am a Spanish American girl. Recently he travelled to New York with his friends to come and see me. We really connected and had a wonderful time. I have never dated a Persian guy and I'm afraid if I just go with it I will get hurt. I don't know if his family would accept me. Interestingly though he asked how my family would feel about him. I assured himmy family wouldnt have a problem. I know this for sure.
Anyway, do you know of any Persian Jewish Men married to a Spanish American girls? How has that worked out? - Curious.
I don't know the "connection" that you are asking about. I do have a bit of advice.
I have been married to my Persian husband for 32 years. When we married he was not concerned about my being from a Christian back ground and I was not a pr acting Christian so it did not matter that he was Moslem.. He also was not practicing his religion so t didn't matter. I did find out though that it mattered to his family. We both became born again Christians while in Iran! Persians are very family orientated, and while you all might hit it off religion might be a big draw back if you all were to get serious. Mothers especially have a big influence on their sons.
Good luck, Faye
wow ... that is quite a mix.
I myself am Californian and my hunny is pure Iranian. He's muslim not jewish and i had no prior religion of my own but was raised christian. we have met some interesting culture and religious issues.
I think that with both of u having strong cultural backrounds u will have several clashes and need to work out a good compramise system. however, u have to choose the man for the man, not his roots. I say risk it. if he's a good man its worth the struggles. if its just a fling it may not be worth the issues that will certainly arise.
Always fight for love. if theres a chance that this is real, i say always risk the potential injury. it may never happen and u could wind up perfectly happy. some of the best relationships come from clashed cultures. give it a go. if his family doesnt approve of u, then he may have to choose u or them. that will be the hard part but many other coples have faced that. let me know how things work. - kathryn
No, I don't know of any Persian/cross couples like that... but I'm sure they're probably out there somewhere.
From my experiences, I can tell you to definately be careful with it. Persian men aren't exactly the most known for they're trustworthiness- but then again it doesn't matter what religion, race, or color they come from... men are men and they will try to get away with alot. Have as much fun with it as you want- but use your head and remember to listen to your gut. Your intuition is very important and has very good grounds for acting up. Stay true to yourself and keep your self respect.
Many Persian men tend to be quite controlling/possessive- don't fall for it! They try to totally control you in all ways but they do whatever they want or exactly what they don't want you to do when you're not around! Watch out! For example, my bf asked me to change my cell phone numbers (twice) because he didn't want any ex's calling me or friends that he didn't like.
I did it for him and I regret it now. He made me stop talking to certain people because he didn't like them for whatever reason. He also made me throw out all my old pictures of past bf's and love letters and stuff.... those were my memories that I threw away for him. A whole bunch of other things came up too- he asked me to throw out all my underwear, bikinis, and sexy clothes.... I did it all for him!! What was I thinking!! ?? Anyhow, he took me shopping and bought me all new stuff which I loved so that was good.
But now I think about it and I regret doing that for him. Those were things that made me the person that I am today- and I destroyed them for him and I can never get those memories back. That was a way of control for him. He also did loads of other controlling things- calling 10 times a day, not letting me talk to certain people, not letting me go out with my friends... and he always had really good reasons for these requests. I did it for him because I loved him and thought that it would make him happy and love me more... but I think it might not have worked that way. I think by doing all his requests made him lose some respect for me. This is what I mean when I say don't lose yourself. Always remember who you are.
I remember after destroying all my old pictures of my bf's, going over to his house and seeing 100's of pictures of him with his ex gf's... I was so mad that I had destroyed all mine for him and he still had all these pictures of his gf's from his past. I freaked out and went through everything and made him destroy all of them!! It was awful! ..he did do it. ..but it really pissed me off that he had such a double standard. Such a hypocrite- you know?
Those were all signs of his true colors showing through. I taught him to cover a lot of stuff up and it scares me now to think about what he's hiding from me. I've busted him on a few other major things as well. At this point, I have a hard time imagining marrying him. The trust has to be there in a relationship and it's not in ours. We are trying to work on it but rebuilding trust is one of the most difficult things because the dishonesty seed always sprouts up once it's been planted.
Now I do what I want to do- and he lets me, he's calmed down quite a bit, but it's not the same now... in fact it's quite different because we had such a rocky journey. Why did I hold on to him?? Because he helped me get ahead in life which was really important to me. He helped me more than my own family and I totally appreciated that. Today I am successful and independant thanks to his support, encouragement, and motivation to keep me focused and I thank him for helping me get here.
Now, I work with successful guys that I trust more than him and I'm meeting some really cool/good people that I have more trust, respect, and better thoughts about! So who knows... life is a journey... people come into our lives for a reason, season, or a lifetime.
From one woman to another, - Good luck! J.
Country & City = USA, CA
Category of Submission = Religion
Subject = Converting to Islam
I read a request on your site for a positive view on converting to Islam. I was raised Christian, as a Latter Day Saint (Mormon). As a child I was very unhappy with my parents faith. Christianity has never settled well in my heart, especially the Mormon branch.
After I left my parents church at 16, I have studied several other cultures and religions. I met my Muslem fiancee about 4months ago. He and his family are very open minded. His parents never forced their beliefs on their children thus allowing them to fallow their own hearts. He loves his faith and is a very spiritual man. The more we talk and the more I learn about Islam, the more I find a peace in my heart. Because of the religious garbage that I was choked on as a child I had put up a wall between me and worship. I find that most of my personal beliefs are very close to the bulk of Islam. Naturally there are a few customs or worship practices that I'm not that keen on such as always covering, finding dog's unclean ! and such.
I plan to convert to Islam when we wed in Iran next year. Even if I don't have the "faith" that my fiancee does and don't fallow the religion for spiritual reasons, I do see the wisdom behind the rules, or as we prefer, "guidelines". Neither of us feels that one must fallow every single idea to the letter, but we can understand the concept and reasoning behind each.
He has not asked me to convert. He only asked (ASKED, not SAID) that he be allowed to expose our children to his faith in the same open mindlessness that he was taught. I am choosing to accept most of his faith for my own personal comfort and happiness.
In reading the Qur'an and talking with him, I find the true teaching of Islam to be very beautiful. Many accuse Islam of being very sexist and discriminating of women, however in my studies I have found just the opposite. The true teachings are very respectful of women. My fiance and his family see the wife and mother as the most cherished and important member of the family. She is treated as a special gift. Unfortunately radicals and politics have discolored the religion itself. I hope that others can take the time to study, question, and learn about this wonderful faith as I have. Kathryn
Years Married = 3
Number of Children = 2
Country & City = USA, NYC
Category of Submission = Religion
Subject = Religion has NEVER been a problem
He's moslem Shi'ite, from a family that is both religious & traditional though he is secular himself as are his brothers and sister. I am a practicing Anglican. We have had no problems with religion at all. Though the Quran says that women are inferior to men and that men can have multiple wives, so does the bible and the Torah. What we choose to do nowdays is another story. We both respect our partner's religious views (as well as other views) to the fullest extent. His parents and entire family in Iran welcomed me when I visited there & they recently visted us and participated in Christmas dinner quite happily. And he didn't marry me for a green card either (he already had US citizenship & even worked in the US defense industry) "Not Without My Daughter" is one-sided, and a movie of only one person's experiences - not the same as reality or accurate depiction of everyone else's experiences. Our kids will be raised to think for themselves and choose whatever religion (if an! y) that they believe in. - Jennifer
ountry = New Zealand, Auckland
See also Dorri's submission to Issues
Your title attracted me to read your story. It's interesting me to know more about your relationship with your Bahai husband. My boy friend is Bahai and I have no any religion yet because I heard from him that Bahai must marry with Bahai religion . That's why till now I haven't baptism to any religion yet. I wish to know more about how life going on with your relationship.I am doing some research and preparing to marry him.cheers. - Dorri
Years Married = 2
Number of Children = 1
Country & City = US, Austin
Category of Submission = Religion
Subject: = Is anyone married to a non-Muslim Iranian?
I am married to an Iranian man who came to US in the mid-80's. I am wondering if any of you are married to an Iranian who is not Muslim? My husband is a Bahai (and was discriminated against in his own country). I am a Christian. We blend together in harmony. Most Iranians that we know, including his whole family are also Bahai. Is there anyone else out there like us? - Denise
Years Married = 30
Number of Children = 4
Country & City = USA, VIRGINIA BEACH
Category of Submission = Religion
Add Email to mailing list = YES
Include Email to posting = YES
Subject: = HOW TO BE HAPPILY MARRIED TO YOUR IRANIAN HUSBAND
I guess I have email some individuals on topics, BUT this is how to be happily married to your Iranian husband.
I am American, my husband of course is Iranian. We dated for one year and married. We kept it a secret as he was in Military and couldn't marry me. We went to Iran, he went to jail for marrying me! He could had divorced me, but he didnt.
We were BORN AGAIN (became true believing Christians) in Iran, thru some one that had a little sign out for "Sunday School". Even though I knew about christanity IF one doesn't practice and truly belive they are not really anything. My husbands family, of course Muslim. BUT like me he wasnt practing. We had some problems, but when the Lord came into our lives, we truly became one.
We have now been in the US for 23 years, have 4 children, and been married 30 years. ALL cultures, all the love in the world isn't enough without Christ. There are many Iranian Christian groups and Farsi books, Bibles and Churches in the US and other countries.I give praise! to the lady I read about that wouldnt marry her boyfriend , because her relationship with Christ was more important. If she sees this and its not to late, she could introduce him to the Lord. There are many Iranian Christian connections and resources on the Internet.
My husband is my best friend and has never been like some of the typical things I hear about. As he is a new creature in Christ. If anyone would like more info on Iranian Christian groups just go to the website or email me. God bless. Faye
My husband and I have been married for 24 years and we have three children. I am an american and a christian. My husband still considers himself a moslem. I have always and will forever pray for my husband. We have been to Iran many times to visit his family.
I enjoyed your email. - Diana
Years Married = 2
Number of Children = 0
Country & City = U.S.
Category of Submission = Religion
Add Email to mailing list = YES
Include Email to posting = NO
Subject: = Why is there so much hatred against Islam?
I have read some of the postings in this forum, and I have to say for some of you who are married or in a relationship with a man who is Muslim, why is this such a huge deal? I wholeheartedly agree with the idea of exposing children to multiple religions--if one religion doesn't get something right, why not complement it with another? But I've seen a lot of postings on here relating to multiple wives, or the way women are supposedly viewed in Islam, and I think many of you have forgotten the most important thing. When you met and got to know the man you're with, you also understood what sort of person he is.
Most Iranian men, ESPECIALLY those who are willing to marry someone not of their own religion, are not the types of Iranian men who will take advantage of what is considered by many to be laws not really followed. Even those Iranian men who DO marry a woman of their religion would never dream of a multiple wife scenario, or think of her in the manner that one posting says Islam teaches them to see her. In fact most followers of Islam do NOT see women in a bad light--women most often rule the roost in Iran, just as they do here. Women have always been the hand that directs the head, without the head realizing it.
For those of you who say the family will not accept you, that is less a religion issue than a cultural issue. It is much the same as an Asian man bringing home a white wife--there are always language and cultural barriers to be overcome. I for one applaud one poster on this forum who asked about learning the Persian language--since when is it not a good thing to expand your linguistic skills? You can teach your children multiple languages. It will make their own linguistic skills that much stronger, and in turn they will do better in school.
At the same time, for those of you who find that language is a barrier to getting along with the in-laws, well, why not learn the language then? You'll find that if you are willing to reach out to the culture, they will respond in kind.! Many in-laws are afraid that you will not understand the culture, or will reject it, and thus not allow your children to become a part of it. How would you feel if the situation were reversed? If your children were raised in Iran, and your husband wasn't exactly conducive to the idea of letting them get involved in American culture, or whatever culture you consider your own, wouldn't you feel hurt? It's a part of you that you wish to share with your children...and that is how many across the cultural divide will see it.
As for the post about what a cheat and liar her Persian boyfriend was, well, it happens in every religion and culture, and I hope you go on to make better choices in men. - Send your respond to Joanne
I just wonder sometimes when I read some of this posting on this site - WHY are you people writing to ZanAmu?
If you had a bad experience don't you think that is more of a symtom of the character of the man you were/are with. Alll relationships have problems for sure and its good to discuss these, but those of you who who are completely slamming your partner and blaming it on the culture it seems to me that that is a form of racism.
I'm so tired of all these "Not Without My Daughter" scenarios. There are wife beaters in ALL cultures, just check the statistics in your own North American city.
I"m so happy to read Joanne's thoughtful e-mail. I thought ZanAmu was here to celebrate our difference and our ways of understanding. Anyway, thanks for letting me get this off my chest.
I thought your email was interesting. I have been married to an Iranian for 32 years and I can say that if my husband practiced his religion our marriage would not have lasted. I'm thankful he let me take our children grow up in the church. Islam doesn't teach love, it teaches hate, an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. It doesn't teach that God loves us so much that he sent His son to die for us and that we are saved by faith not works. It teaches that we must work our way to heaven and this is impossible because we will never meet God's standards by our works.
As a matter of fact one of my husbands oldest friends, who he knew in high school in Iran had two wives for about 20 years. We didn't find out anything about this unitl two years ago, he hid it well. He is poor now and can hardly survive. I cannot feel sorry for him. His American wife finally divorced him and she is happier than she has been in years. You know the old saying when you make your bed you have to lie in it.
Women are treated like crap in Iran. When a husband dies the property goes to the children not the wife. Women have very few rights, especially now in land of the mullahs. I'm so thankful I never had to live over there. I have truly been blessed.
It's true what you say that women most often rule the roost in Iran, just as they do here. I think this is why so many Iranian women are so manipulative, indirect and nasty. They have had to learn to be that way to survive. By saying this you may think that I don't get along with Iranians. I get along well with the ones who don't use taroof and don't play games.
One of my husband's three sisters is a tyrant and is doing everything in her power to break up our marriage. However the rest of family is nice and I get along well with them. I can truly say the main reason I have never been able to get along with this nasty sister is that she has never accepted me. I can only understand about 50% of Farsi and she uses this against me at every chance she has and my husband insists on speaking Farsi on the phone when he speaks to his sisters. This drives me up a wall. If I had my live to live over I would have learned Farsi but I can truthfully say I never have married someone from another culture if I had known I would have encountered all of the problems that I have.
It is truly amazing that I am still married, all of the people we know have divorced, even my husband's three sisters are divorced and they were married to Iranians.
Sometimes this is true that if we are willing to reach out to the culture, they will respond in kind - but it depends on the person you are dealing with. I don't think it would matter what I did - I don't think I will ever be able to get along with my husband's nasty sister. I have tried for 25 years and nothing has worked. I give up. I have decided that this sister is not welcome at my house anymore and that if she has to come I will ignore her unless I am forced to talk to her.
God is good and he provides blessings along with the curses, because I get along extremely well with my husbands other two sister who live here. They call me and I call them My husband's youngest sister has truly been a blessing in my life.
I wish you luck in your marriage to an Iranian. I can truly say it has been very difficult. I met my husband when I was 19 and we dated in college for 3 years and then married. - SilverTabby
I think some of your views are a bit naive. I guess you probably are mainly socializing with well educated and non-religeous Iranians. But, I am sure you would have a different view if/when you meet some blue-color religeous Muslim men. I was shocked when I recently heard the husband of a friend of a friend say that, "If God gave him the right to have more than one woman, then how could there be anything wrong with it?". He was very proud to mention "his friend" who gets a good temporary girl friend everytime he visits Bahrain. I guess they call it "seekeh" or something like that. Its all legal and is performed as a religeous ritual!!!
Well, I am sure you understand why my friend is concerned about her husband planning a business trip to Saudi Arabia next month.
I agree there are good and bad in every culture but we are talking about the basics of Islam - I think we should know what are the possibilities when we get into a mix-relation with a Muslim sweetheart (Iranian or not). - Kathy, Minnesota
Hi! I'm glad to hear your point of view. You have many valid points. Having been married to an Iranian for almost half of my life, I feel like I have a pretty good understanding of the dynamics that go on.
I see you've been married for two years and have no children as of yet. I'm also curious as to whether or not your in-laws are here or in Iran?
As far as the problems one encounters with in-law many of these problems are cultural but it is very hard to separate religion and culture in Iran. Religion was not an issue for my husband and me, however, it was a very big issue for his family. The main issue as a matter of fact. It became even more of an issue once the children were born.
I certainly don't feel Islamic men have a poor view of women. If I did, would I be married and have stayed married for all these year? I have not forgotten why my husband and I first came together, however, when you've been together for twenty plus years your view certainly becomes different as it would in any relationship.
Have you have extended visits from in-law? I'm just curious. All the Farsi in the world won't solve that. - Sisterhair
Thank you for your e-mail, I too have got angry about some of the e-mails in there. but at the end of the day it is just a few people's stupid views?
me personally do not judge people because of what they are just who they are, i have never come across any problems with in-laws as yet, i to can not speak farsi , but when my sister in -law came here she could not speak english but by the end of the stay we had both learnt a little of each others languages and could commicate , .
I have converted to islam and accepted it in my heart so i do not have the religious problems others have so at the end of the day i would not worry about it Send your respond to emma
Years Married = 13
Number of Children = 3
Country & City = United States
I have been married to my Persian husband for 13 years. He is Moslem and I am Mormon. Though the religions are quite different, they are also similar in the belief of the strong family unit and various morals. Since I am and have been the Sunday church goer, and though my husband is Moslem he doesn't really practice, the children are baptized and raised in my religion and go to church with me. It is hard because church attending is one thing we don't do together. His parents don't know that they are baptized in my faith. I'm sure they wouldn't approve but my husband knows that his children are getting a good upbringing. -J.
Years Married = 20
Number of Children = 3
I am Catholic and my husband is Muslim. All three of our children were baptized and our intention was to expose them to both religions. When the children were young this worked well, however, as they got older this became increasingly more difficult. The only programs in our area are on the weekends making it the impossible for our children to particicpate in sporting activities which they are very good at. There was no flexibility within the Persian community. We are from New York and I have found that the Persian community is not organized. Most ethnic groups have strong ties to one another but I find this is not the case with Muslim Iranians.
I would love for my children to be more exposed to the Persian culture and interact with Persian children but unfortunatley there just isn't enough of an opportunity for it. On the other hand they have been very involved with school related sports and other activites.
My children all go to Catholic school. Our son was given a wonderful opportunity to go to free Catholic HS and he's doing wonderful..
My point is is that the Catholic religion is offering things the Persian Muslims are not.
My Iranian boyfriend comes from a wonderful background and family. However I do have many things racing through my mind. What religion will we raise our children, how will I interact with his family (they live in the U.S. but not all of them speak English), will there be a lot of barriers due to language and religious ideas, what will our children look like (I am a blonde American), will they be picked on when they grow up because they are a mixed race......
I have many questions and I am looking for some guidance. - Ryall Fox
What is the concept of concubines in Islam? What's their status? What about the children?
I have had several questions on the subject of Concubines in Islam in the past couple of years. Everytime I have asked about it from my in laws, they say it doesn't exist any more but I keep hearing that Haj aqa so and so in Tehran has Concubine, Mr. so and so, a distant cousin has a concubine. I asked a co-worker who is originally from Saudi Arabia and she said it is very common in Saudi Arabia. So, have been looking around to see its legal (Islamic) definition and history and I came across this Email which I would like to share it with you.
I want to understand the concept of concubines in Islam. Somehow or other the concept is pushed under the rug, whenever I have to tried to bring it up at various places.
These are my concerns
A very authentic Hadith narrates that Take care of whatever is in between your teeth (ie tongue) and whatever is in between your thighs and I promise you Jannah.”
According to Sahih Bukhari Rasool Allah (saws) used to teach the young teenagers, that tell me and I will get you married to anyone you want, however do not do the Sin of Zinna.
As per the above narrations it is quite obvious that the only kind of sexual relations acceptable in Islam are those of the married couples. But then time and time again I come to read the fact that Rasool Allah (saws) used to have one or two concubines too, aside from his 13 wives? This is very confusing, please explain.
What is a concubine?The slave girl (see the end of note for the definition of slave girl in Islam) that was allotted by the state to the respective household, thus became the consort of one member of the household. Only this person was allowed to have a sexual relationship with this slave girl. The difference between this person’s wife and the slave girl was that his wife came into his house through the proper marriage contract (Nikaah), and the slave girl was allotted by the state.
What is the status of a concubine in a Muslim man’s life, esp a married person’s life?The status was like his wife. Only the person who was allotted the slave girl was allowed to have a sexual relationship with her. If the slave girl was allotted to the father, then the brothers or the sons had absolutely no right towards this girl. The other difference was that the Islamic law of equality of time and sustenance did not apply between the wives and the slave girl.
What is the status of the offsprings of this relationship-- to the man, in their lives, wealth and will etc?The children were exactly like the other children from the person’s legally wedded wife. They were to be given exactly the same rights as his other children. The children of the slave girl would inherit the property exactly as the other children. There was absolutely no difference amongst the children. And once any slave girl bore a child, she could not be sold to anybody else and thus became a permanent member of the household.
Does she have to be a Muslim, or the religion in this relationship is not of concern?No, this slave girl did not have to be a Muslim. In fact, all the wars fought were between the Muslims and the non-believers, thus most of these slave girls were non-Muslims. But through this system of allocation, this woman was encompassed into Islamic society, and because of the behavior and character of the Muslims of the times, the woman, more often than not, would accept Islam.
How is this any different from the modern days concept of mistress/prostitution/adultery?There is a huge difference between the slave girls of those times and the system of prostitution which is so prevalent as a disease in today’s society.
The slave girl was a social issue of the times, which if not solved by Islam would give rise to adultery and prostitution.
n prostitution, the woman sells here services for a fee to anyone who is willing to pay! The slave girl was taken into a household as a full member.
In prostitution, the woman has sexual relationships with many men! The slave girl would have sexual relations only with the person she was given to; very similar to the husband-wife relationship, the only difference being that the wife came into the house through a marriage contract, and the slave girl was allotted to the person by the state.
Prostitution is a result of illegal lust, and is a huge sin in the eyes of Allah. The allocation of slave girls was a issue of the times to envelope the woman taken as slaves in a war into the Islamic society.
Prostitution and adultery do not have any responsibility attached to it! The man-woman have a one-off relationship and depart. The slave girls were a responsibility of the person, who spent on them, gave them a place to live, fed them, clothed them, and raised their children as his children. The children from adultery and prostitution are regarded as born out of wedlock and grow up without the name and without the shadow of a father. The children of the slave girls were known as the children of the person, grew up with his other children, and had exactly the same rights and inheritance as the other offspring. T he system of slave girls was accepted and respected by the Islamic society of the times. The slave girl was treated like his wife, and the children from these slave girls were treated like their children by society. No religion, no state, no moral society accepts and respects the institutions of prostitution and adultery. This is a disease of society and every moral society has tried to eradicate this disease with little success.
Your comment But then time and time again I come to read the fact that Rasool Allah (saws) used to have one or two concubines too, aside from his 13 wives?The Messenger of Allah (saws) had 11 wives in total during his lifetime, and the most wives he had at any one time were nine. Some of the allotted captives of war and slave girls, became his noble wives and received the title and honor of being called the ‘mother of the believers’ by Allah Himself in the Holy Quran. Amongst them was Hadrat Saffiyyah, who was a Jew. She was allotted to the Prophet (saws) as a slave girl, converted to Islam and was married to the Messenger of Allah (saws). Another of his wives who came as a slave and was allotted to the Prophet (saws) was Hadrat Jawarriyah (r.a.) from the tribe of Banu Haris. She too converted to Islam and was married to the Messenger of Allah (saws). He also had a couple of slaves girls whom he did not marry, like Hadrat Maria Kibtia and Hadrat Rehaana, for reasons best known to Allah and His Messenger (saws). But the scholars are unanimous in their opinion that the Messenger of Allah (saws) treated them with love and respect exactly like his other wives. And even after the death of the Prophet (saws), these slave girls of the Prophet (saws) did not marry anybody else like his wives, and they were respected by the Muslims in the same honor as the other wives of the Prophet (saws).
Your brother and well wisher in Islam, Burham (http://www.dawoodibohrahelpline.com)
Name = Andrea Jeddi
Years Married = 10
Number of Children = 2
Country & City = Kuwait, Salwa
Subject: = concubines
Perhaps it would be fair to explain to those who are asking about concubines the notion of a temporary wife, which IS prevalent in Iran, but not in Saudi Arabia.
Shi'ite muslims often have temporary wives, and by convention, they do not believe they have a responsibity to tell their other wife(ves). Perhaps they are confusing the two. Andrea Jeddi
What a difference religeon makes?
Country & City = Fiji,
Category of Submission = Issues
SubjectWhat a difference religeon makes
I can honestly say that 6 months into dating an Iranian man I have felt more secure (just a little bit!) than in the beginning. I was raised a Christian born into a strong Christian home and I never throught I would end up dating a Muslim. Its ok for him to remain as he is and any changes I think will be between him and the Lord. I value him as an individual so much but I don't want to get in the way so as to cause disharmony between the culture he has his family his beliefs and his own rihts to express himself. I am Fijian and the way we have viewed Muslims growing up is as mates, allies and helpers. So I guess I'm not too surprised God has got one in my life! - Alena Koroi
Is it legal for a Muslim to have sex with all his WIVES at the same time?
Question: If a man can marry more than once then is it legal for him to have sex with his wives at a time, together?Yes, any Muslim man is allowed to marry more than one wife but It is prohibited for a man to have sex with all his wives together; and it is also prohibited for a woman to open her ‘satr’ in front of another woman.
Question: Couple of days ago one of your q&a said that looking, touching, kissing, or dating with an woman who is not married is not allowed in Islam...then my qus is...how someone is gonna love someone if they cant be close to each other or cant talk?Islam has strictly prohibited the act of ‘zina’ (fornication and adultery); and as is the principle of Islam, if a thing is prohibited, all the roads lead that to such an act are also forbidden.
Besides, what some people call ‘love’ out of wedlock; Islam rightfully recognizes that as forming an illicit, immoral, and illegal sexual relationship! ‘Love’ in Islam is not considered as shallow and as superficial as some of the so-called modern-educated ignorant people would like to believe! ‘Love’ is an honorable term that is developed between a couple after marriage. Islam has rightfully differentiated and segregated illegal ‘lust’ from true ‘love’; which most of the ignorant people of this world seem to think as synonyms.
Islam has allowed a couple who wish to marry to meet as often as they like, provided the girl is accompanied by a male-mahram relative of hers. Islam has allowed the couple to talk to each other as often as they think is necessary, provided a male mahram relative of the girl is present! Thus if the couple want to meet and talk serious talk, there is no restriction …. The restriction is placed for the protection and honor of our sisters and our daughters, so that some smooth-talking guy does not show-stars-in-the-sky to your and our honorable sisters and daughters! Whatever he wants to say, he may say it to the prospected girl, in front of her brother, or father, or uncle. But that arrangement is sort-of extremely uncomfortable for Mr. Slick; isn’t it? Mr. Slick cannot do his smooth-talking in front of the girl’s brother, or father, or uncle… because he fears he might get caught in his smooth act! And thus this arrangement is seen by him as a hindrance to develop his ‘true love’ for the girl!
Your question what about a different culture,,,where guys get to meet girls then they get married after dating a while?What about it? Its great (and probably extremely naïve) to think that in different cultures guys meet girls, date for a while, get married, and live happily ever after!!!
Do the believers sincerely want to pay the moral and social price that is associated with these different cultures?
Consider these scenarios, which are more realistic than the fairy-tale and naïve scene of guy meets girl, dates, gets married, and lives happily ever after
Guy meets girl, dates for a while, realizes not going to get a sexual break, dumps her!
Guy meets girl, dates her for a while, breaks her heart, looks for another girl!
Guy meets girl, dates for a while, checks her out sexually, dumps her!
Guy meets girl, dates for a while, gets girl pregnant, boy disappears!
Guy meets girl, dates for a while, girl gets pregnant, boy denies he is responsible!
Guy meets girl, dates for a while, girl gets pregnant, family forces them to marry!
….. should I try and give any more scenarios…..?
One only has to look at the societies where this sort of culture exists, study their statistics of single mothers, abortions, teen-age mothers, broken marriages, broken relationships, etc., and if that does not scare them; Allah Alone knows what will!
Question: what if that person dont find anyone who wants to get married without dating, is that person gonna stop looking for someone and not get married?The person who sincerely wants to get married, is interested in getting married; not in dating! In the cultures where family bonds are strong, and relationships are deep, and every individual recognizes his or her responsibility towards their un-married children and relatives…. Getting married is often the least of the problems!
The problem of getting married is profoundly complicated in the societies where dating is the norm. When a man can get a taste from any plate he wishes to fulfill his lust and desire, why on earth would he settle for one!
One should check out the social statistics and see for themselves which societies, and which cultures have the biggest percentages of unmarried, or broken marriage individuals….. and if the results don’t appeal to our sense of honor and morality, we aught to dig deep into our conscience and figure out whether we are any better than the animals who roam and breed at will!
Whatever written of Truth and benefit is only due to Allah’s Assistance and Guidance, and whatever of error is of me. Allah Alone Knows Best and He is the Only Source of Strength.
Your Brother and well wisher in Islam, (http//www.dawoodibohrahelpline.com/)
Name: Margaret Nikkhah
Subject: Re: Is it legal for a Muslim to have sex with all his WIVES at the same time?
I agree that LEGALLY he can have up to 4 wives, but I have heard that now the current wife(ves) must agree to any future marriage (not 100% certain of that). About 15 years ago I met someone who had at least 3. It's not really encouraged. I know of two other cases where the husband has/had two wives. Admittedly the last two cases involved elderly men. The man is SUPPOSE to consider whether or not he can treat each equally and can support them and any children. Very often this means separate residences for each of his wives. Few, if any, men can really fulfill those requirements if they are honest with themselves. As far as having sex with all of them at the same time, that sounds like an orgy which obviously would not be permitted by the religion and probably would get anyone who participated in "legal" trouble should someone protest (witnesses are needed to support any accusation of an immoral act). - Margaret Nikkhah
Love A Muslim: A Support Group for Christian Women Dating or Married to Muslims
The "Loving a Muslim" (LaM) mailing list is a forum and support group for non-Muslim women (mostly Christian) dating or married to Muslim men. The purpose is to share our experiences and questions among ourselves, learn from each other and encourage each other.
Please visit our site and join LaM mailing list to participate.
I JUST WANT TO REMIND YOU THAT IT IS ILLEGAL FOR A MOSLEM WOMAN TO MARRY A NON-MUSLIM. ANYONE WOMAN WHO DOES THIS IS NOT ONLY A TRAITOR TO HER CULTURE BUT SHE IS DESTINED FOR HELL. I SEE ALOT OF IRANIANS WHO DO THIS AND IT DISGUSTS ME VERY MUCH. STOP MARRYING NON MUSLIMS AND STOP BEING TRAITORS TO YOUR CULTURE.OK S. Joseph
As an American Jewish woman who is happily married to an Iranian-born man of Muslim heritage, I find it offensive and scary.
For those of us who live in the United States, it is also erroneous.
If the writer feels this way and chooses to conduct her life accordingly, so be it. But to disrespect, judge, berate and threaten eternal damnation for anyone and everyone who feels, thinks and/or behaves differently is extremely hostile, misguided and dangerous, particularly in these times.
This type of ignorant and arrogant bullying has nothing to do with Islam, Judaism, or Christianity. All of these fine traditions developed out of a quest for peace and morality and mutual respect amongst humans. Most people with a truly religious or spiritual education and agenda would passionately agree.
It is consistently those with a political, economic and egotistical agenda who are pretenders to a moral high ground. They abuse religion as a convenient medium to broadcast such messages to people who don't know any better than to live in fear and contempt for those who are different from them. It has been done repeatedly throughout history in the name of Allah, of Yahweh and of Jesus and under the flags of many different countries and tribes. But just it is done, just because a persuasive person says it, it doesn't mean we have to fall for it.
Look throughout history and then look in the mirror and then ask yourself what good ever came out of such an attitude or impulse. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts after such an inquiry. - Alison
Dear S. Joseph,
I don't agree with what you are saying at all but I can not deny that it is a fact and it is an Islamic rule. I have been told that if my Christian American husband ever wants to travel to Iran as my husband that we have to marry (re-marry I guess) according to Islamic traditions and that he has to accept Islam. My brother who is married to a very nice Christian lady, was told the same thing when he was planning to take his wife back home. Of course, she refused to convert. A Muslim friend of mine who lives in San Jose, recently explained to me that this rule is based on very reputable Haddith (i.e. Prophet Mohammad said so and practiced so). So, whether we like it or not, it is an inherent part of Islam. - Laila
Number of Children = 0
Country & City = US, North Carolina
Subject: = Religion and Children
I have been married to a wonderful Iranian husband for almost 4 years. My husband kind of made the choice for me. He said it is important that our children be raised as Muslims, because their father is Muslim. At first I was upset and we fought about it a lot, but then I realized that no matter what religion our children are brought up with, it doesn't matter, as long as they turn out to be good people and have a strong foundation with their religion, that is what is most important to me. I believe that no matter what religion a person is, if they have a good heart and are true to themselves, they will go to heaven. I am hoping that our children will grow to be strong and caring individuals with strong family and moral values. We will still celebrate Christmas and Easter and the other Christian holidays, because I will not convert, so my children will actually get to know both religions. Anyway, when they grow into adults, who's to say they won't convert on their own? Religion is a personal choice.
Anyone else in the same boat? - Wendy
Years Married = 3
Country & City = united states, Los Angeles
It is very important for me to have come across this site in the Internet. Many of the stories listed are similar to my own experience. My question is if we have different religion, which religion we can teach our children, because I want my children to be Catholic and he thinks is better to be a Muslim.
please somebody can tell me what to do in this case
Thank you, kodahafiz. - Cristy
I was in the same predicament. In fact, if anything, my situation was a lot worse than yours. My mother is Jewish, my father Catholic, and he is Muslim. My parents raised me with both religions. I had a bahmitsva when I turned 13, and I went to Church every Sunday. Ironic, isnt it?
Then I married a Muslim, who is not really hung up on religion, however, holds culture dear to his heart. What does this make our children? VERY confused - to put it mildly! So we decided to raise our children with best of all worlds.
We have exposed them to all three religions, as well as both types of culture and family values. Keep in mind that a lot of the moral and ethical contents of Islam are those of Catholosism. Though Catholosism denies the existance of Islam and Muhammed, it is completely the opposite for Muslims. Why not teach them both? Start with Baptism, yet do the rituals performed on infants through Islam. If memory serves me right, it consists of having a Holy Man, not necessarily a mullah, but someone who is very faithful, read "Azoon" in the child's ear. The parents get to pick an Islamic name for the child, and this Holy Man (not woman) reads that name in the child's ear as well.
This is similar to picking a God-parent for the child. It is an alternate (religious) name, where in Catholosism and Christianity as a whole, a God-parent resembles an alternate person to "rely" on.
I mean what is so different between the religions? Who the children ultimately believe in? I feel when my children are old enough, they will make that decision on thier own. I know from experience that I am not old enough to decide yet, and I dont know if I will ever be. I know that I was raised with religion, morals, values and ethics; that is how I am raising my children. Who they consider "God" is entirely up to them. What religion they wish to practice in the future is entirely up to them as well. We have taken the route of exposing them to all, knowing full well that they are similar in many ways, yet distinct in other.
Good luck and best of wishes! -Aunna
I dated an Iranian man for 6 years and during that time, we were engaged for almost 2 years. I feel that religion was the least of the problems between us! His family was very devoutly Muslim, so he was raised that way, but was open to other religions as well. He often came to church with me, and he accepted and respected my Christian beliefs.
Character, however, was an entirely different issue. Our relationship fell apart when he admitted that he had another girlfriend on the side. I began to see in a different light the man who I had believed to be my soul mate and the one true love of my life. My gentle, kind, loving fiancé turned out to be a master at deceit.
It’s my belief that his culture and family life had a tremendous influence on his character. I thought he had more integrity than that which existed in his family – they simply accepted lying, stealing, and cheating as a way of life. He always swore that he wouldn’t turn out that way, but in the end that’s exactly what happened.
I think back to all the little white lies that I had brushed aside, and suspicions that I had pushed to the back of my mind. Now it all seems so clear, but when you love someone you desperately want to trust and believe in him. My ex was a very good, convincing liar, until he couldn’t keep up the act anymore, and I couldn’t tolerate his lying and cheating.
Today, I am engaged to a wonderful American man whose religion, values, and culture more closely reflect my own. Dating an Iranian was a real learning experience; unfortunately it is one that I would never repeat if given the chance! - Joanne
This is a wonderful site. I am dating a Persian man and I care for him but we are not the same religions and I want to settle down but I alreaday see big problems if I choose to invest more time with him. Reading this site confirmed in me on what a loss it would be if I continue to date this man. He is so wonderful but he isnt a Chrisitan and my relationship with Christ means more to me than him. My only consolation is that I hope that I meet another Persian man that is saved and filled with the Holy Ghost. THANKS FOR THIS SITE IT IS FABULOUS!! - R. Auguste
This is just a general opinion on marriage between Muslims and Christians. There are really two things to consider: how religious you are and how religious he (or his family) is. No matter what religions are involved, if you feel strongly about your faith don't marry someone from another. And if his family is religious, that could influence him tremendously when you have kids.
Most people begin to care more about spirituality and religious roots as they age and have kids. Stay respectful of each others belief and look for common ground, there is much. My husband has attended Christmas Eve services on a couple of occasions. He has taught our daughters how to pray namaz. My mother-in-law always wants me to take her to church when she's here (and I don't go that often) and says it's all praying to the same god anyway.
I have done a lot of reading about Islam, including classes in college involving important Muslim writings. We should be informed on these things early on, as it gives some cultural background and insight.
Just wondering if ANYONE EVER EVER EVER sends you anything IN FAVOR of Islam or being a Muslim? : ) Would you post it if someone did ; ) ; )
I can recall 2 such Emails. One lady claimed to have switched religion from Catholic to Baha'i after her Christian husband cheated on her and then to Islam because she didn't feel welcome at the Bahai center in Chicago. Another lady wrote "I changed my religion to Islam to be more acceptable to my in-laws".
We found neither one a good enough example to be put online. If you check ZanAmu's past issues, you'll see several testimony of women who changed their religion because of the request or insistence of their boyfriend/husband - we have not received a solid personal testimony of how a devoted Christian's life and walk with God improved as a result of switching her religion - or how the marriage improved because of changing her religion or how her status or personal relation with God improved as a result of changing her religion.
If you have one such a testimony or know of somebody who does, please forward it and I promise to push it thru the review process and have it put on line ASAP.
Islam teaches that men are superior to women [Sura 2:228]
Islam teaches that women have half the rights of a men...
Islam considers the wife a possession. [ Surah 3:14 ]
Islam teaches that women are unclean. [Surah 4:43 ]
Islam instructs women to veil themselves always when they are outside their homes. [Surah 24:31]
Prophet Mohammed teaches that women are lacking in mind and religion [Al Bukhary Vol.2:541]
Prophet Mohammed teaches that women are a bad omen [Al Bukhary Vol.7:30 ]
Prophet Mohammed teaches that women are harmful to men [Al Bukhary Vol.7:33 ]
YOUR SEX LIFE:
BEFORE YOU SAY [I DO ]:
It is so hard on Nami. He is a Christian as well, and now is looked at by his family as a traitor. Another thing is I love Persian food and I want to start cooking it, but I need a cookbook. Do you have any suggestions, or is there anywhere on the web I can go?
As for my relationship with Nami, I have never had a better one with any other man in my life. He is senstive, caring and very attentive. He can have ADHD like any other man sometimes, but we always laugh it off. I praise God for bringing him into my life, despite all the family troubles. My family loves him, which is great though.
I would love to talk with other women who have experienced anything similar to this. Also, are there any Farsi tapes where I can learn to speak it? I would love to surprise my hubby with learning his native language.
In Christ's Love, Tina Nahid
You will know the truth, and the truth will set you free. (John 8:32)
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